Just posted this to the SC forum, and decided to post here as well ... for those that don't frequent that forum...

I've got an idea for any extra money lying around. After witnessing several of our students first hand during the clinic weekend with rolling skills that IMO were not yet river roll ready, and knowing that along the way we will encounter other new students wanting to learn to roll I think we should invest in some sort of extended pool session plan. 1 / month minimum or 2 / month ideal. I would not make it on the weekend if at all possible as even Fri nights or Sun nights will affect weekend travel plans. If not the Y, then maybe Pavillion in Georgetown? The KY River is OK when it starts to warm up in the Summer, but it's not clean and is definitely not a fun place to wade with all the debris there. But we could utilize the river for extra sessions for those that are comfortable learning there.

I just feel like we've left quite a few of our students hanging with shaky pool rolls (on a good day) at best and leaving them to just transition to a river roll now? And what of the new folks that come along between now and Dec? Do they just have to wait?

Wes

Hey Wes, It's funny you mention the desire for more roll sessions as I am planning on talking about this issue in my officer report tomorrow at the meeting at Riptides. I have a few ideas and the Y is currently looking at other nights that may be conducive (during the week). I will get all the information I have out in the open tomorrow. See you there hopefully. J

Joey Calder

Hey Joey,

That sounds great. Can't make tomorrow night.... working but should be at mtg next week. Look forward to hearing about it.
Thanks!
Wes

Repeating my comments as well:

I'm all in favor of extended rolling sessions. I feel this would be extremely beneficial to many of our new members. However, I wish to point out that many of our clinic participants are typically underprepared in the area of rolling despite our best efforts, and that (in my humble opinion) this particular clinic class was better prepared than many I've seen.

The biggest hurdle is dealing with last-minute add-ons, and that just can't be helped. Sure, a person can be taught a basic roll in a single pool session if they're quick on the uptake, but translating that newfound skill to moving water is another thing entirely.

I am also strongly in favor of creating a club library, but I agree that the best thing to do would be to donate the purchased material to the Lexington Public Library where it would be available for checkout. We could even stamp our logo on it potentially, "Donated by the BWA" as a way to advertise.

Hanley

Hanley,
Hope you didn't think that I meant that we had folks in the clinic that were unprepared to be there. I've never felt that someone should be kept off the river without a roll! On the contrary, sometimes I think a couple of river swims helps to increase enthusiasm / effort for the next rolling practice! I think we should allow folks down the lower Noli their first time in a boat if they want..there are certainly some individuals that are adept enough athletically to do at least that. My best ever student learned to roll in 5 min and was did Fall Creek to Woodall on the Chattooga just shy of 2 ft for his first run... without swimming (walking the Bull, of course :-0 ). Sadly, he just never developed any interest to continue the sport.

I simply meant that we had students at the clinic that needed some more pool work, and all our noobs don't magically present in the Fall only. Noobs will come along throughout the year, and I think we should have a means to help them learn to roll within a reasonable time.

Wes

Agreed Wes. I may not see eye to eye with you about the benefits of taking a swim, but we definitely agree about the need for more pool sessions.

My view on the subject of swimming is that a novice paddler, in the process of developing a new set of instincts to supercede their natural desire to claw for air, should ideally have enough pool time prior to getting on the water that at the very least they are comfortable enough in their boat to make a roll attempt or two when they first end up upside down. Swimming out of the boat becomes a learned habit far too fast, and will become a boater's security blanket far too easily. It's a tricky tightrope to walk because each paddler picks it up at a different rate and has a different level of anxiety about being upside down in a rapid.

Certainly the knowledge that the reality of swimming is not pleasant can be motivation to work on one's roll and to make the attempt one more time in the pinch, but it can also be an intimidation factor and anything that increases apprehension makes it harder for a novice to concentrate on their roll.

I hope we decide that we can afford to schedule some summer rolling sessions. From my personal perspective, I feel like we should probably think about doing it somewhere other than the Northside Y so we won't wear out our welcome for the winter sessions. However, Joey would be a better person than I to comment on this.

Hanley

Wes/Hanley:

This sounds good. Let's make this happen. Joey - your thoughts?

Brent

I am open to other pool options. I have contacted the Y because in the discussions a few months ago when they wanted to move us to a different day and time after our sessions had already begun, they expressed a desire to continue to grow this relationship. It was actually their suggestion/question of if we would be interested in summer sessions. It is however, as Hanley mentions, a fine line that we walk with our welcome at a facility. We don't want to wear it out. With other facilities though, we don't want to tread in others toes. I know Canoe KY has offered sessions at other facilities, which ones specifically I will have to double check. But we can definitely explore these options. J

Joey Calder

I'd love to have summer pool sessions. If we're lucky, we can have them at the Cumberland Hills pool out Tates Creek road.

A little summer pool session history...

Around '98 or '99, Nick Giglia and myself, after a luke warm response from the BWA steering committee, partnered up, initiated and funded private blackmarket pool sessions at the Shillito Park pool. These pool sessions, once proven to be viable, were adopted by the BWA.

In 2000, the pool session was moved to the Cumberland Hills pool. This pool was cheaper and a BWA member(Brian Wright?) was a lifeguard there. This was a private pool, owned by the neighborhood association. They allowed us to use our own lifeguards, who volunteered their time, making it even cheaper for the club. Thanks Kathy Rose, Brian and ??? You guys rock.

Unfortunately, some "members of this pool" complained about poor behavior on our part. Mainly, boaters showing up early and getting in the pool while regular pool members were still there swimming and boaters descending on the parking lot & street, clogging the parking area with cars, trucks, vans and boats, to the point that pool members had a difficult time getting to their cars and out of the parking lot. We were invited to NOT return.

We need to remember to keep our enthusiasm in check in order to avoid this type of scenario again.

The pool was then purchased by 3 people, one of which was a client of Barry Sipple's. Sipple and I partnered up to fund the blackmarket pool sessions with the meager proceeds going to Elkhorn Acres.

The next year, shortly into the season, we convinced the BWA to adopt these summer pool sessions and have held summer pool sessions there until last summer. While pool sessions normally fall under the umbrella of the Safety Chair, I ran these pool sessions myself for several reasons, but mainly because they were my idea(sorta) and I thought it was unfair to expect the Safety Officer to have to take on this added responsibility.

Last year, in the middle of negotiations for use of the pool, Barry Grimes initiated free roll sessions at Boonesboro Beech.

The Kentucky river is pretty clean as opposed to what it was like years ago, but for many people, spending a bunch of time upside down in the river trying to learn to roll is a little too much. I think the clear water of a swimming pool is a better environment to learn in, if we can secure a pool.

I'd like to see the club continue these summer pool sessions, hopefully at the Cumberland Hills Pool. I talked to the current owner of the pool Tuesday morning and he's still working out the schedule for the summer. I'm hoping they can squeeze us in. I requested Wednesday night, with Thursday being 2nd choice. I should have an answer in time for the meeting next week.

Sounds like a great option to me Dale ... especially since I live 5 min away . Another option if the Y or CH doesn't work out may be the Pinnacle Pool on the other side of Veterans Park from CH. The reason I mention them is I've gotten notices of them contracting out the pool for another group for swim team practice, so they seem to be open to doing such things. Also, have we ever tried to approach the city re: one of they pools? I also agree that wherever we go that we need to be on our best behaviour!

Wes